As much as i like 2001 (book and movie) I find "Star Maker" has deeper meanings or, at least, I understood it better (i read 2001 at 14 or so and re-read 4 or 5 years later while I got to read "Star Maker" much more recently).
Anyway you better keep in mind Stapledon wrote that book in the 30's. Back then it seems many authors were concerned about what was better (or "less bad") capitalism, comunism, anarchy... and where would those methods go if taken to the extreme. Said authors used sci-fi and other genres to show their views and doubts (Huxley's "Brave new world" or "Un mundo feliz" in spanish is an example of that as the even earlier "We" "Nosotros" by a russian guy whose name I can't remember).
Some of those points of view, doubts or concerns might seem outdated nowadays although IMHO they are as valid as they were back then just as much as Orwell's 1984 comes to mind with security paranoia and on/offline privacy loss today.
Original (first) "Dune" novel is a good read imo. Nice universe, some good characters and a new twist to space travel. I got tired of rebirths, inmortal people and that "melange" thing after the 3rd book if I recall properly. Haven't re-read those.
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^^ LOL, we are hickjaking my own thread. Anyway:
- I really LOVE (very) old days' political-fantasy worlds. As you stated, they showed their own concerns about political regimes, morality and so.
- I'll check some of the books you recommended.
- Have you ever read "Solaris"? I think it can be a good choice (I didn't read a single page of it)... I watched the 2002 film and started to watch 1972's soviet film about the book, but it was amazingly SLOW and I couldn't watch it till the end. Any comments on this?
watched it today!
5 years... PERFECT.
best series I've ever watched, agree with my compadre a lot is still unsolved but i'm sure most will be debated and clarified from now on..
the final episode?
GREAT! LOST IS ABOUT PEOPLE. and the end was just perfect.
(Tim is going to jump on me..oh don't give a crap.lol) - Lost portrayed one of the meanings of life. watch it , carefully, and you will understand.
looking forward to discuss more with msv-1.
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Brave New World and 1984, even the short story Harrison Bergeron, are all very analogous tales of what is and has happened with our society. I actually find these to be far more than just about "security paranoia", but a societal pervasiveness of suppression.
Then you need to watch more TV shows.Originally Posted by Natzo
I figured out what was wrong with Lost. The writers were insulting to their audience, they wrote an onion. Sure the onion is multi-layered and they gradually peeled a layer off, but the layers were transparent and didn't reveal anything while stinging the eyes.
btw tim, if you haven't read it already i recommend you read russian "We" I mentioned above. It presents (as you could imagine given its origin) a communist-to-the-limit society with such a paralelism to the one presented in Brave new world it's not even funny. It's a tiny little book you can read in one afternoon, not sure how easy to find tho.
Here's the wikipedia article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/We_%28novel%29
@mvsf1: Solaris is a great book too. Back to the topic of Dystopian sci-fi, Bradbury's Farenheit 451 is a must-read too.
10 reasons why LOST sucks
10 reasons LOST sucks - Why Lost Sucks
1. Nothing ever really happens. Oh, you think something is going to happen. The previews show that something is going to happen. Sadly though, in the end nothing really happens. It’s amazing that you can watch a whole season of the show and end up pretty much where you started. Yep, still on the island. Nope, still don’t know what all the crazy stuff happening is about… Throw us a bone people.
2. The shaky camera work. Oh this is a biggie. We are all well aware of this cheap trick used to intensify the drama of a scene, or worse yet, to insert a false sense of drama where the plot is lacking. Hold the camera steady for the love of Pete. We will decide if the scene is intense enough and if not we can shake our heads back and forth rapidly. There are enough Bruckheimer shows in the world already.
3. Kind of the opposite of the last reason, but equally annoying: the staring factor. By my rough estimates, a good 17 minutes of each episode is devoted to someone staring at someone else, or some object. The casual viewer may miss this one, but look for it. People just don’t stare at each other that much in real life. I think for one of the future blog entries I will actually take a stopwatch and record the “net staring time” for an episode.
4. 3 episodes then reruns for a month. What’s up with that? Yes, it’s filmed in Hawaii and I’m sure a lot goes into each show, but film the whole season then air it. Other shows are able to do that, why not Lost?
5. The flashbacks. They don’t add a whole lot for one thing, and not everyone could have killed someone before they got to the island. I mean how many people’s flashbacks are about them killing a person or persons? I think the fat dude is the only one who didn’t. Oh wait, his “curse” did kill a few people if I recall.
6. New characters. How many new people can they introduce to the show that is set on a deserted island in the middle of nowhere? You wouldn’t think there would be so many people ending up there. You’ve got a whole community of “others”, a French chick, a dude that was in the hatch, all the plane crash people, and now some balloon guy. This island has more people than your average Club Med.
7. The Dharma Initiative. This is so ridiculous; I’m at the point where I don’t even care what it’s really about. Between the guy in the movie and the clever marketing logo, it’s just a bit too over the top. I swear they ripped off this shadow organization from an old episode of Get Smart. If they break out a Dharma Project cone of silence I will throw a shoe through my TV.
8. They find a steel and concrete fortified bunker/hatch (actually many of these) but yet they all still choose to live happily in the open on the beach, while man eating creatures and scary smoke beings roam the island. Don’t you think seeing a man ripped to shreds by a huge monster would make you want to have a metal door between you and the outside world while you slept?
9. The original premise is flawed. If a plane breaks apart at that altitude, there would be no one left to be “lost”. It should have been called “Crashed” and been a one episode show.
10. Pressing the countdown button. Enough said.
dude when I get home I may go "Line" with that post..
Just finished watching the finale.
There is sooo much unnecessary material in this show. Honestly, the writers should have given it a little more effort not just randomly thrown around ideas and tried to pull everything together with the last season.
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If I remember correctly the release of EM caused them to time-travel, which was utterly unnecessary, I mean why didn't it happen this time? Because the messed with the heart of the island and the EM from it was more ''special'' than in the past, thus making everything alright?
If Jacob had chosen them at the beginning then why did it take 6 seasons for him to tell the truth rather than just appearing and talking nonsense?
If you die on the island you can still spawn on mainland alive?
Oh and the polar bears, wtf?
I still kinda enjoyed that show
First of all, I found very childish and inmature making a web to critize some thing you dind't like. Move on. Get a life. Discurssing is fine to me, but 99% of this webs is all about hate.
Ok, back into the thread:
What means "nothing happens"? No nuclear bomb explosions? No explicit sex? WTF menas nothing happens? Lost has at least 5 or 6 main plots and HUNDREDS of small plots. That's a fact. Period.Originally Posted by SomeCrappyWeb
The drama of the scenes in Lost is the words they use. Period. If you do not follow the whole thing you'll not understand most of the episodes and then you'll fix your attention in "shaky camera work". What a marvelous point...Originally Posted by SomeCrappyWeb
The same.Originally Posted by SomeCrappyWeb
What? Is this written by a retard? I find no words to describe another "magical point" by this man.Originally Posted by SomeCrappyWeb
Did he really means flashbacks, flasfordward or flash-sideways? They are three kinds of "time moving" scenes in Lost. I'm sure this guy didn't realise that. Anyway, people in the island is there for a reason: there are not "normal" people on island. What's wrong with that? This is a TV-series, man, I can't imagine Friends with a "I do nothing and I'm not funny" guy, just because he wouldn't fit in the plot. Period.Originally Posted by SomeCrappyWeb
So many people? No more than a hundred, I don't think that number is that much. I mean, every supossed point of this guy is totally stupid. I could understand if he bothered about: "Why electromagnetism healed Rose's cancer?" Ok, we could discurss about that but..... "There are lots of characters"? Fuck off man.Originally Posted by SomeCrappyWeb
WTF? Dharma is a group of scientifics trying to understand electromagnetism, human attitude and some other things. Kinda unreal..... LOL.Originally Posted by SomeCrappyWeb
The fortified bunker was built to make an experiment, dumbass. Black smoke never harmed the island's people till the end (and we losties know why).Originally Posted by SomeCrappyWeb
The first point that can be considered that. I agree. Yeah and their clothes lasted for three years. Yeah, they never cut their hair in front of the camera. Ok. I agree.Originally Posted by SomeCrappyWeb
Read answer number 8. Nuff said.Originally Posted by SomeCrappyWeb
PS: this guy's website is laugheable.
He states his reasoning, he was forced to watch it by his wife after he, like many people, gave up on the show.
The bomb wasn't for 2 seasons, the sex took even longer to get to. Any show will have just as many plot lines, it is almost inherant in having more than one character. You are missing that what is happening and the plots are actually are just parts of what would be happening in any other show.Quote
Shows and movies that use shaky/hand cameras and quick cuts are usually using the technique in place of actual action. It is a well known technique. They use it extensively in action films, quite often in chase scenes to distract you from the fact that the chase is being done at a very slow speed.Quote
He is American and would be seeing the shows as they air, not at a later date as they are in other countries, where they can show them continuously. I'd add to his point that the final episode is on this evening (I have it on now) in Aust and started at 8:30, when it hasn't screened at any earlier than 10:30 in 2 seasons (this is like saying we have it tonight in prime time when it hasn't been anything other than a graveyard slot in ages).Quote
His complaint is that they have literally used a very lame film technique (equivilent to putting the text location on screen to tell you where something is set rather than establishing this naturally) to create characters, rather than have them develop naturally through the story development. It is also a very convenient happenstance; hey look I can make up anything about some random character with this cut away rather than actually have the story evolve it.Quote
It is a very large ensemble cast. This means that you have too many "key" characters to develop and thus spend more time on backstory than you do on actual real story. That's fine if you want to do character studies, but it is insulting to the audience.Quote
You've misunderstood his point. He is saying that the likelihood of an scientific organisation being so selective with its information is just laughable. You can't run experiments when the people there have so little information fed to them. The only reason this makes sense is because that is the stupid way the information in this show is drip-fed to give the illusion of mystery.Quote
Never harmed?? It killed people in the first season and the second season! And it doesn't make sense to have a bunker, great place to be warm and safe on a hostile island, and not use it.Quote
It was a comment that they didn't do the simple stuff right on the show. But I agree some points are largely ignorable, like how we rarely see people ducking off to have bowel movements, because it is assumed it happens (except to Jack Bauer who only shits explosives).Quote
What is laughable is that you have largely dismissed rather than addressed his issues with the show.Quote
I almost disagree with whole of your post, Tim. I'm sorry. We wouldn't agree.
- PS: polar bears thing is explained back in the 4th or 5th season.