Mumbai getting pwned.

[Flex]

al quaida is weakened, about 80 % of the organisation is wiped out and alot of their leaders are killed.

Several of their leaders have been taken out, but how are they weakened? From what I've read, they're stronger than ever. They've had alot of success in Afghanistan and Iraq in the past couple years, which always results in more recruitments.

still though, we have not seen any major terrorist attacks on US or european soild the last couple of years, and i do honestly believe that taking action against the extremists was the right thing to do, though it may not seem that way all the time.

In all seriousness, how often do terrorist attacks take place in America? (before the Bush Doctrine) 7 years free of terrorist attacks is nothing to brag about if you ask me.

 

[Ironslave]

bullying and unprovoked sanctions huh? how is a horrible war against china and its east asian neighbours unprovoked exactly? the sanctions were put in place to restrain japans aggression. strange how u always complain about america imperialist policies, but when its another country vs the US then its just totally different. japan were looking for a new asian order, they were extremely aggressive and commited some of the most horrible war crimes the world has ever seen in nanking, where they were they even used biological weapons against the civillian population. isnt that just as bad? using bio weapons and killing hundreds of thousand of chinese civillians, how isnt that just as bad as dropping nukes. why do u think chinas and japans relationship even today is so uptight, its still a source of conflict, the things japan did in china, korea etc.

What did Japan do to provoke America? Nothing? Exactly. I truthfully have no idea if you're just trying to be difficult, or if you believe this shit. America wanted to get into war with Germany (and I'm going to anticipate your wrongness in advance, NO, they did not want war with Germany because of what Hitler was doing in the concentration camps, because they had NOT been even formed yet.) Problem is, the american citizens didn't want war, and there was no way they'd tolerate a first strike. Hitler wasn't stupid enough to attack America, and America had no way to lure him in, but they could imfluence Japan, and they did.

up to the citizens? japan was a facists state, i dont think alot of decisions were up to the citizens so to speak. keeping the emperor in place after the war he led japan into, would be kinda like letting germany keep hitler in place when they surrendered. look, i do not doubt that america had ulterior motives( preventing russian agression, US dominance etc) but at the end of the day, what matters most the way i see it, is that i do think the bombs saved lives. the US had destroyed like 60 cities with firebombs, and the japanese were still willing to fight to the last blood drop. a land invasion would have been extremely costly, and the use of the bombs ended the war. i dont think most understood even how horrible the weapons were before they were used, and i do think it made both russia and america realize how important it was to make sure they werent used again.

.... they DID keep the emperor in place you moron, lol.
Here's what happened: Japan tried to surrender, but it wasn't unconditional (they had to keep the Emperor). America refused, bombed Japan, and then accepted a deal that was the EXACT SAME AS THEY REFUSED BEFORE. (maybe not quite exact, but pretty close, keeping the Emperor was the sticking point). If America wanted, they could have accepted the exact same deal before, and it would have ended the war. Thus, this shows that dropping the bombs was 100% unnecessary. The fact that this happens completely refutes any of the rest of the complete propaganda that you type.

After these quotes, I'm not going through the rest of it, it makes me feel like less of a person.

 

[Bulkboy]

.... they DID keep the emperor in place you moron, lol.

way to go IS, hope everyone sees this before they vote in the best debater thread.

i got that wrong, i actually thought the emperor was removed, sorry my bad. still, the emperor did loose all political and military power and was solely made the symbol of state, so their political system was still transformed.

 

[Ironslave]

way to go IS, hope everyone sees this before they vote in the best debater thread.

i got that wrong, i actually thought the emperor was removed, sorry my bad. still, the emperor did loose all political and military power and was solely made the symbol of state, so their political system was still transformed.

It just goes to show though that you always assume America is out to do the best, and it invalidates everything else basically. They didn't give a shit about what the emperor did, or what he didn't, or what was happening to the Japanese people.... as always, they had their own agenda.

 

[Ironslave]

.... also, this was stated in the other thread as well... but to no surprise, you ignored it. Things like this aren't opinion, it's fact. Not changing your opinion with suggestive evidence and such is one thing..... but to overlook fact is another.

 

[Flex]

Bulk, you say you were for the war in Afghanistan from the beginning. But the entire first month of the war we focused on overthrowing the Taliban rather than the people who attacked us.

Most of Al-Qaeda escaped into Pakistan, we let them escape. I think your numbers (80% Al-Qaeda taken down) are dead wrong, but I'd still like to see a source if you have one.

In the short run Afghanistan was a success, but in the long run it's a complete failure. Obviously we overthrew the Taliban and occupied their country, but the violence never stops. I even said in a thread a while back that we should have worked out a deal with the Taliban in the beginning, now after all the lives lost we're doing just that. Thus we're basically right back where we started, all the lives on both sides were wasted, and I was 100% right.

The war on terror is a fraud, that's a known fact.