Back Training

[afgan-ali]

i've noticed alot of ppl have very different approaches to back training and its one of the hardest body parts to train properly, just today we were having arguments about how to properly train back with some of the boys at the gym, i was sayin that rowing and deadlifting is just as important as pulldowns/ups, and everyone got involved some sayin machines are best.

I just want to know ppls thots on back training, whats their favourite back routine and why they like it, what benefits they get from their style of back training.

Myself i split my back day into to different sessions
back/ shoulders, and back/ biceps few days later

day 1 -
pullovers - 2 warm up sets
3 sets x 10-12
wg pulldowns
3 x 10 - 12
cg pull downs
3 x 10-12

day 2 -
bb rows 2 warm upsets
3 x 10 - 12
cable rows
3 x 10 - 12
deadlift
3 x 2 - 6
shrugs
3 x 10 - 12

i no it might not be the best routine but it does the job i think.

 

[tim290280]

Most lifters are relatively weak in the middle and lower trapezius and usually have over active upper trapezius muscles. Most people also don't actually do back exercise as much as their pressing (although there is a trend for the more experienced to do more back work) and usually overuse their lower back.

I prefer some sort of supported row, whether this be a DB row (on a bench), prone row, etc, of course you can't go past a cable row, pullup, chinup, and power lifts like cleans and deadlifts. Pulldowns are fine and work quite well but are really marginal in comparison to the pullup/chinup.

I've also started doing a rope exercise that is brilliant. It is like a face pull except done with a rope attached to an overhead bar that you use your bodyweight as resistance. Similar to a fatman pullup (inverted pushup) except done with a rope so you can pull your arms apart to really hit all the scap retractors, middle and lower traps, etc.

 

[Big_Guns_Lance]

People make back training very comlicated when it is very simple. It is the largest muscle group of the upper body so it does need to be hit from different angles rather than say the biceps. I like to split my training into the upper areas of the lats, middle of the back and then ending with the lower back. But you can't just do one exercise and say it helps build such and such a part of the back, most back exercises works the whole entity of the back, but putting emphasis on certain areas. So my back training looks like this;

UPPER BACK-
1) Hammer strength pulldowns or chin ups
MIDDLE BACK-
2) Barbell rows
3) Close-grip seated pulley row
LOWER BACK
4) Deadlifts

I feel my routine hits all the areas of the back from top to bottom. Also I train HIT. So I'll do 2 warm-up sets and then I'll do one majory heavy set known as the working set, I take that set to positive failure and almost all the time beyond failure by intesity techniques like rest/pause.

Hope this helped you out

 

[El Freako]

I will make on suggestion, place more importance in deadlifts. They're the all important lower-back developer but they also contribute to the upper-back aswell. Move deads up to day 1 and give them 5 sets of 2-6. Also if you do enough deads then you may as well throw away shrugs all together. They just won't be needed anymore.

Also maybe rearrange it so the you do a horizontal pull and a vertical pull on each seperate day rather than working the same angle twice each session.

 

[The_KM]

All good, quality posts.

I really agree, many people have insignificant, overlapping exercises that make routines a lot more complex than they need to be.

You need the following:

A deadlift
A low (chins/pulls, pulldowns, etc.)
A mid pull (rows, prone, etc.)
A high pull (shrug, high clean, etc.)

Sufficiency would be to up the volume if this not a high enough stimulus, instead of adding other exercises that place the same workload on the same muscle group.

YOUR ROUTINE HERE

Your routine is off the charts bro. Are you doing these in two consecutive days? Hope not. Consistently changing exercises really does little in terms of overload. Results will be from neurological adaptions, which is not the goal of your regime.

Also you need volume. I'm down with frequency, but not in the manner you have it.

Hope this helps

 

[afgan-ali]

i split my training into

day 1 - chest, tri
day 2 - shoulders, lats
day off
day 3 - legs (squats and sl deadlifts)
day 4 - back, biceps (rowing movements)
2 days off and repeat

 

[afgan-ali]

ive just started this style of training, and am going to due a 6 weeks trial and see if it benifits me. should i continue or stop and changee??

 

[youngmusclejock]

People make back training very comlicated when it is very simple. It is the largest muscle group of the upper body so it does need to be hit from different angles rather than say the biceps. I like to split my training into the upper areas of the lats, middle of the back and then ending with the lower back. But you can't just do one exercise and say it helps build such and such a part of the back, most back exercises works the whole entity of the back, but putting emphasis on certain areas. So my back training looks like this;

UPPER BACK-
1) Hammer strength pulldowns or chin ups
MIDDLE BACK-
2) Barbell rows
3) Close-grip seated pulley row
LOWER BACK
4) Deadlifts

I feel my routine hits all the areas of the back from top to bottom. Also I train HIT. So I'll do 2 warm-up sets and then I'll do one majory heavy set known as the working set, I take that set to positive failure and almost all the time beyond failure by intesity techniques like rest/pause.

Hope this helped you out

Second this!

 

[ibanezman1988]

my back workout goes like so.

deadlifts
pullups (at least 5 sets)
rows
rows

i think pulldowns are important to add into a back routine too because they are TOTALLY different from pullups. they work very differently.

deadlifts are the mother exersise for back

don't stray too far away from barbell rows, dumbbell rows, and t-bar rows. these are what works and what nobody wants to do because they are hard exersises but produce results

and the best exersise for bringing in detail and pumping your back best IMHO, is close grip seated cable rows. one of the best back exersises. but this should be used as a supplement to your freeweight regime.

 

[Bhana]

I do what KM does,
I train each muscle Twice a week
Day 1: 5xDL, 3xShrug or hang clean
Day 2: 3xPull up, 2x BB row/DB row

My traps are weak though

 

[tim290280]

i think pulldowns are important to add into a back routine too because they are TOTALLY different from pullups. they work very differently.

Yes pulldowns are easier

Pullups when done correctly provide better loading, and better recruitment patterns. Chinups are in some ways superior to pullups, but they should both be done interchangably.

 

[ibanezman1988]

pulldowns IMHO, should not even be compared to pullups as they are a totally different exersise. and they can be harder than pullups depending on how you do them.


you don't like pulldowns?

i agree that they are inferior when it comes to adding width compared to pulldowns.

but pulldowns are a bit more versatile as they allow for a little more freedom of motion that in turn might hit muscle fibers tha pullups cannot.

just sayin' i think one should incoorporate both.

 

[tim290280]

pulldowns IMHO, should not even be compared to pullups as they are a totally different exersise. and they can be harder than pullups depending on how you do them.

How can they be harder? They have no-where near the loading potential, by their very action they cannot be maximumly loaded without losing the target recruitments, and they are generally done instead of pullups which is just lazy.

you don't like pulldowns?

i agree that they are inferior when it comes to adding width compared to pulldowns.

No I don't like pullups much. They do have their benefits, EMG studies have shown they can be very good at muscle recruitments. But those benefits are only sort lived when loading considerations are taken into accout. They are a open kinetic chain as well so they suck in those terms too.

but pulldowns are a bit more versatile as they allow for a little more freedom of motion that in turn might hit muscle fibers tha pullups cannot.

just sayin' i think one should incoorporate both.

How are they more versatile????? If you are strong enough pullups offer all sorts of variations and loadings.

If you aren't strong enough to do pullups, what are you doing on the pulldown machine? You should be learning to do pullups. Too many people want to run before they can walk.

 

[El Freako]

If you aren't strong enough to do pullups, what are you doing on the pulldown machine? You should be learning to do pullups. Too many people want to run before they can walk.

Quoted for truth. Pullups and chins piss all over pulldowns as an exercise.

 

[Skeptic]

i can only do like 4 dead hang wide grip pullsups, but they feel soo much better than pulldowns.

 

[El Freako]

i can only do like 4 dead hang wide grip pullsups, but they feel soo much better than pulldowns.

In 2003 I couldn't even do 2, now I do them weighted for 10-12 reps sometimes. You just have to keep on doing them 'til you get stronger.

 

[Skeptic]

In 2003 I couldn't even do 2, now I do them weighted for 10-12 reps sometimes. You just have to keep on doing them 'til you get stronger.

hehe yeah... i found that out the hard way

 

[Zigurd]

Yay for me, I can do 20 weighted pull-ups.

I have found that out of ALL the back exercises I have ever done, pull-ups make my lats grow faster than anything. The only exercise that comes close are barbell pull-overs.

They are sore as fuck the next day too.

 

[bizarro306]

really good thread!

 

[jonathan]

pull ups, chins, goodmornings, deads and rows
i don't like to use exercises with cables