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MuscleMecca Natural Ability Debate

Ironslave

Ironslave

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damn i´m weak i´ll admit, this month i can´t go to the gym much maybe 2x a week. i have a contest coming up in nov 29th, so i´ll be shooting for that, next month will be better. the reason for not going to the gym often is$$$, been broke this month and paying bill but next month will be alot better and will buy me a membership

A contest? Come on.

Max, you've gotta set some serious CONSISTENT goals dude. One day you want to bulk up, then the next you're trying to get to 5% body fat, now you're trying to be in the NBA (not literally, but you get the point).

Whichever goal you want to work towards is fine. If you don't want to bodybuild, and would prefer to train for sports and stay healthy, great. But you've got to make up your mind.
 
Duality

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you think athletic ability is a skill do you? you can work to improve yourself, but if you don't have the genes of the guy next to you, it will make little to no difference. you can't teach speed. you thinking it can be acquired through practice is either a blatant lack of understanding for genetics and what fast twitch muscle fibers really are, or stupidity. chose one.
 
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Ironslave

Ironslave

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Duality, it's posts like this which keep people from voting you VIP.

Of course, nobody is saying Max has the potential to qualify for the Olympics. With training, could he shave a few tenths of seconds off his 40 time? Absolutely. In sports, this makes a WORLD of difference.


Edit: even those who DO have the genes to be an elite sprinter have to spend countless hours and years being TAUGHT how to improve. Sorry, but you won't find any average Joe running 100 yard dash in 11 seconds without considerable training.
 
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Maxmonzter

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A contest? Come on.

Max, you've gotta set some serious CONSISTENT goals dude. One day you want to bulk up, then the next you're trying to get to 5% body fat, now you're trying to be in the NBA (not literally, but you get the point).

Whichever goal you want to work towards is fine. If you don't want to bodybuild, and would prefer to train for sports and stay healthy, great. But you've got to make up your mind.



good post, i did think about it big time and i choose bodybuilding, i can´t live without it. i´m a big fan of bball and wouldn´t mind being good at it but i love bodybuilding more, i think i could make a fine bball player but bodybuilding is so much more fun and it is what i love doing after a hard day of work. bodybuilding is my passion so there you go, bball is just a hobby but nothing more
 
Duality

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Duality, it's posts like this which keep people from voting you VIP.

Of course, nobody is saying Max has the potential to qualify for the Olympics. With training, could he shave a few tenths of seconds off his 40 time? Absolutely. In sports, this makes a WORLD of difference.


Edit: even those who DO have the genes to be an elite sprinter have to spend countless hours and years being TAUGHT how to improve. Sorry, but you won't find any average Joe running 100 yard dash in 11 seconds without considerable training.

what about the post don't you like? my stance on athletic ability being 95% talent? or my tone while addressing tim? if it's the first than that's cool but i disagree, if it's the latter, i invite you to go back a page and see who cast the first stone and was insulting ;) rarely do i ever set the tone with an insult, however i'm always deemed the person who "started it"
 
MikeTyson

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good post, i did think about it big time and i choose bodybuilding, i can´t live without it. i´m a big fan of bball and wouldn´t mind being good at it but i love bodybuilding more, i think i could make a fine bball player but bodybuilding is so much more fun and it is what i love doing after a hard day of work. bodybuilding is my passion so there you go, bball is just a hobby but nothing more

Man.. I don't think you've got it.. It aint about no basketball man! It's about sating a goal and stick to it like.. "I'm going to bulk up for 8 months" and do it.. not like.. it passed 2 months and you say, now, I want to get to 5% BF NONONO.. You must stick to it you know?!

Good luck buddy..
 
Ironslave

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what about the post don't you like? my stance on athletic ability being 95% talent? or my tone while addressing tim? if it's the first than that's cool but i disagree, if it's the latter, i invite you to go back a page and see who cast the first stone and was insulting ;) rarely do i ever set the tone with an insult, however i'm always deemed the person who "started it"

I know, I saw Tim's post. Sorry, but you said you "can't teach speed", which is just absurd. Nobody is doubting that you must have favorable genetic characteristics to be an elite level athlete. If we took Max when he was 12 years old, and he trained with the best sprinters in the world, by the time he was 20, he probably would still get blown in the dust by them. However, he could certainly progress far more than if he didn't bother training for speed at all.

To give you a personal example, I played hockey growing up. I have long legs and the flattest feet you will ever see, so I was always slow. However, I worked my ass off (especially in the off season) on my technique, and just training as hard as I could. When I moved up to try out at an elite level (major junior hockey), speed still wasn't one of my better aspects. But I could keep up, whereas 5 years before I was struggling to keep up with my pee-wee teammates.
 
MikeTyson

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Forget about my gramatical errors.. I can't edit in this shit
 
Duality

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I know, I saw Tim's post. Sorry, but you said you "can't teach speed", which is just absurd. Nobody is doubting that you must have favorable genetic characteristics to be an elite level athlete. If we took Max when he was 12 years old, and he trained with the best sprinters in the world, by the time he was 20, he probably would still get blown in the dust by them. However, he could certainly progress far more than if he didn't bother training for speed at all.

To give you a personal example, I played hockey growing up. I have long legs and the flattest feet you will ever see, so I was always slow. However, I worked my ass off (especially in the off season) on my technique, and just training as hard as I could. When I moved up to try out at an elite level (major junior hockey), speed still wasn't one of my better aspects. But I could keep up, whereas 5 years before I was struggling to keep up with my pee-wee teammates.



again this goes back to that lengthy debate we had and it boils down to athletic criteria. yes Ironslave, OBVIOUSLY one can improve on there own abilities through practice, but as you said, it doesn't matter how long or with whom max trains, he will never be able to hang with the faster guys who naturally just have superior ability. THAT is what i mean when i say you can't teach speed, you can teach ways to improve on it, but whoever has the most fast twitch fibers is always going to win, and that was my point more or less.
 
Ironslave

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again this goes back to that lengthy debate we had and it boils down to athletic criteria. yes Ironslave, OBVIOUSLY one can improve on there own abilities through practice, but as you said, it doesn't matter how long or with whom max trains, he will never be able to hang with the faster guys who naturally just have superior ability. THAT is what i mean when i say you can't teach speed, you can teach ways to improve on it, but whoever has the most fast twitch fibers is always going to win, and that was my point more or less.

If Max was trying out for the NBA, yes.

If he's playing a rec league in Iceland, no.
 
Duality

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^ your point: you can always improve on what you have, and i agree
my point: you can't make someone "fast", faster maybe, but not fast (big difference). they are born with it, then you can enhance it from there. but it is absolutely a talent, not a skill.
 
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master splinter plays basketball???
 
Ironslave

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^ your point: you can always improve on what you have, and i agree
my point: you can't make someone "fast", faster maybe, but not fast (big difference). they are born with it, then you can enhance it from there. but it is absolutely a talent, not a skill.

Quit nitpicking when you're clearly wrong. I guarantee that if Max trained for speed with proper technique and training for a year, he could easily become one of the fastest people in a men's league in Iceland.
 
Duality

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Quit nitpicking when you're clearly wrong. I guarantee that if Max trained for speed with proper technique and training for a year, he could easily become one of the fastest people in a men's league in Iceland.



i don't mean to be (overly) disrespecful here, but i just laughed when i read this. you obviously have no understanding nor appreciation for the magnificence and unmatchable qualities of natural talent. take this from someone who was always one of the best athletes in what he did (basketball and track) to someone who openly admitted he was slow and unathletic (you); you can't teach speed or physical ability, period. the naturally best always rise to the top. it's not fair that a guy with poor genes can bust his ass and never be as good as the jock, but that's the way it is. the guy with poor genes can improve on what he's been given sure, but the fact you think someone like max could get some plyometric shoes and work on his speed with rigor, and become as you say "one of the fastet people in men's iceland league is just......:49:.....sorry
 
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i don't mean to be (overly) disrespecful here, but i just laughed when i read this. you obviously have no understanding nor appreciation for the magnificence and unmatchable qualities of natural talent. take this from someone who was always one of the best athletes in what he did (basketball and track) to someone who openly admitted he was slow and unathletic (you); you can't teach speed or physical ability, period. the naturally best always rise to the top. it's not fair that a guy with poor genes can bust his ass and never be as good as the jock, but that's the way it is. the guy with poor genes can improve on what he's been given sure, but the fact you think someone like max could get some plyometric shoes and work on his speed with rigor, and become as you say "one of the fastet people in men's iceland league is just......:49:.....sorry

You are, by a landslide, the most arrogant poster at MM ever. I wish you had the ability to be humble towards a man who is as superior to you as IS is in the training-specific educational sphere. With such an attitude you would definately not get far in my country.
 
Hypocrisy86

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Did someone delete my post?.
tell me before hand please, thats just fackerd up to do..

I have to agree with Tunen here, for once. heh.
 
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Tunen

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Did someone delete my post?.
tell me before hand please, thats just fackerd up to do..

I have to agree with Tunen here, for once. heh.

If moderation is deemed necessary it will happen. We don't confer with members before moderating.
 
Bulkboy

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glad u found out what u wonna do max, now focus on ur goals at hand:tiphat:
 
chadcruz

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I think what it all comes down to is doing what makes you happy. If lifting weights is enjoyable and something you look forward to, then great Max go for it. If you have fun playing basketball and its something that makes you happy then great. I do however agree with some of the other posters, if you are going to set goals 1.make them realistic and achievable and 2. be consistent.
 
Duality

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You are, by a landslide, the most arrogant poster at MM ever. I wish you had the ability to be humble towards a man who is as superior to you as IS is in the training-specific educational sphere. With such an attitude you would definately not get far in my country.



my my that's quite a distinction. we are all peers on this site, and though i do have respect for ironslave's intellect, i have every right to disagree with him when our opinions defer (and this is an opinionated arguement). i was not disrespectful nor insulting towards him and nor was he towards me. you seem to feel like there are members on here who are infallible, and that is simply not true, no one is. think what you like about the ability to become a superior athlete or one "of the fastest in iceland" from just training alone, but it takes far, far more than a dedicated mind towards his training to achieve those goals.
 
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