Why the UFC is a step backwards for martial artists

[***]

To me, your last post made your seem a lot more intelligent, more mature, and more for the sport/life of MA. Your other posts just seemed like you wanted all out street fights, which there will never be a fair one. I can see how you would get mad when someone waters down the sport you like but they are doing it for the money. It always boils down to money. However, I don't think any other organization will get to UFC level. Specially if they don't have the rules and ability to protect their big names and are able to promote them.

Thank you

I know it takes a long time to explain yourself properly on the net. But the truth is I do love the idealism of MMA. Thanks for articulating it better than I have.

 

[***]

The guys at the top in all weight classes are true MMA athletes....there evolved. There not one trick ponies

I have never questioned there athleticim but as for the rules they are questionable. It does come back to Money and who has invested into the event.

As for the one trick ponies comment. Thats what the UFC want you to believe. Just because a few very good strikers are able to function with out the advantages of hitting to the back of the head and heal stomping/ elbowing a miss timed technique. Doesn't take away the fact that certain strikers have been disadvantaged by the rules. (BTW that doesn't mean that grapplers won't dominate if they where allowed to use these techniques/ truth is we really don't know what will happen)

I think Big04pimpin said it best know one likes to see a big name get beaten if the rules where made to be fairer not good for $$$ who run the event

 

[JS316]

Mua tai fights you can kick the head of an opponent when he is going down happens all the time, you can even kick in the groin. Knee and heal stomps are common. Hitting to the back of the head is allowed also downward elbow strikes

Wrestlers like dan severan and others like to body slam but not allowed. Because they Pwned a lot of so called ultimate fighters with it.

Boxing Rabbit punching is common practice also striking to the back of the head

UFC is not the only MMA around. Knees on the ground are legal in some forms, so are heal stomps. What do you mean by bodyslams are not allowed?

 

[Beau]

UFC is not the only MMA around. Knees on the ground are legal in some forms, so are heal stomps. What do you mean by bodyslams are not allowed?

My thoughts exactly...you can slam an opponent at anytime, rampage powerbombs ftw! how about the Hughes knockout slam on newton?

 

[JS316]

I think the only point you're getting across is it's not "no holds barred". True.
In a real street fight you can use weapons, have extra guys blind shotting people,choke people out until they die. There are no rules.

If the fight stalls on the ground for too long the fighters are stood up. You would think if it stalls on the feet for too long (like on the weekend) they would be put on the ground because they are soooo biased towards BJJ...according to you.

 

[JS316]

My thoughts exactly...you can slam an opponent at anytime, rampage powerbombs ftw! how about the Hughes knockout slam on newton?

 

[Ironslave]

What is the point of this thread?

This is actually what I don't like about the increased popularity in MMA, rest assured many people are just going to get into it just so they can be the tough guy on the playground or in a bar because they want to know they can beat the shit out of people, instead of knowing they can defend themselves (big difference in those perspectives).

If you're training to beat the shit out of people in street fights, Muay Thai is probably your best bet to train with because you obviously don't want to end up on the ground or turn your back away from someone else who could jump in and blind side you.

UFC is largely BJJ, sure. Why? Because it is what is very effective for those rules. Think about it, you're in a cage 1 on 1 with someone, you know that there is no risk whatsoever of someone else jumping in, so it makes sense that if you are fighting a very strong striker in Muay Thai you obviously want to put them on the ground where they can't use their skills. The converse is also true, if you're an excellent striker but lousy grappler then you want to stay on your feet. It just so happens though that it's very difficult to get back to standing once you are taken down.

UFC is a skilled sport, there are rules, just like boxing, wrestling, or pretty much any kind of martial art. It's not a step backwards for martial arts at all, if anything people are more likely to take up all forms of martial arts, and of course, when they do compete in that particular sport, they will adhere to the individual rules.

 

[Arcane1129]

You do realize that the UFC was closer to what you described earlier and was almost completely shut down until they implemented the new rules? They're not trying to emulate all-out brawls- they just allow for a mix of styles and techniques. If these rules weren't in place, getting paralyzed or hospitalized from a UFC fight would be pretty common. Fewer people would participate because of the greater danger and few people would watch because of the brutality (how much is too much?).

I don't think it's a step backward for martial artists at all- you compare it to street fighting, but that's not martial arts anyway. If a boxer feels they're ata a disadvantage in the UFC because of the rules, they should stick to boxing.

 

[JS316]

What is the point of this thread?

This is actually what I don't like about the increased popularity in MMA, rest assured many people are just going to get into it just so they can be the tough guy on the playground or in a bar because they want to know they can beat the shit out of people, instead of knowing they can defend themselves (big difference in those perspectives).

If you're training to beat the shit out of people in street fights, Muay Thai is probably your best bet to train with because you obviously don't want to end up on the ground or turn your back away from someone else who could jump in and blind side you.

UFC is largely BJJ, sure. Why? Because it is what is very effective for those rules. Think about it, you're in a cage 1 on 1 with someone, you know that there is no risk whatsoever of someone else jumping in, so it makes sense that if you are fighting a very strong striker in Muay Thai you obviously want to put them on the ground where they can't use their skills. The converse is also true, if you're an excellent striker but lousy grappler then you want to stay on your feet. It just so happens though that it's very difficult to get back to standing once you are taken down.

UFC is a skilled sport, there are rules, just like boxing, wrestling, or pretty much any kind of martial art. It's not a step backwards for martial arts at all, if anything people are more likely to take up all forms of martial arts, and of course, when they do compete in that particular sport, they will adhere to the individual rules.

Bro there is no way UFC is more BJJ than other styles. Of course it helps to have good BJJ, but Boxing,kickboxing,Muay Thai,Wrestling and Judo play big parts also. It starts on the feet and you are stood up for inactivity on the ground.

 

[Ironslave]

Bro there is no way UFC is more BJJ than other styles. Of course it helps to have good BJJ, but Boxing,kickboxing,Muay Thai,Wrestling and Judo play big parts also. It starts on the feet and you are stood up for inactivity on the ground.

Oh I know this, they all can play a major role for sure and I never said they didn't. I was addressing the initial guy's post though where he talked about the BJJ being bad for martial arts because it wont help you win a street fight .

I still think though in a typical UFC fight, BJJ is often times the most frequently used part of the fight.

 

[Beau]

Oh I know this, they all can play a major role for sure and I never said they didn't. I was addressing the initial guy's post though where he talked about the BJJ being bad for martial arts because it wont help you win a street fight .

I still think though in a typical UFC fight, BJJ is often times the most frequently used part of the fight.

Yeah BJJ comes into play alot when the fight hits the mat but for the original poster to say the UFC caters to BJJ fighters thats just wrong. Like J said every fight starts on the feet. Besides only one of the current title holders is a BJJ fighter that should speak volumes on this topic

Lightweight-Sean Penn BJJ
Welterweight-GSP Hybrid
Middleweight- Silva Mua Tai
Light HW- Rampage Wrestling
HW- Randy Couture Wrestling

 

[***]

Bro there is no way UFC is more BJJ than other styles. Of course it helps to have good BJJ, but Boxing,kickboxing,Muay Thai,Wrestling and Judo play big parts also. It starts on the feet and you are stood up for inactivity on the ground.

There are several ranges of combat its just the UFC can only demonstrate two of them. Because the other is banned

Of course its rigged for BJJ its designed and promoted by them

You are not allowed to
11. Striking to the spine or the back of the head. (see Rabbit punch)
Put in place to disadvantage strikes from taking advantage of a miss timed take down or clinch.
10. Striking downward using the point of the elbow. (see Elbow (strike))
Once again put in place to disadvantage a striker from beating his opponemt to the floor
11. Throat strikes of any kind, including, without limitation, grabbing the trachea.
Again should be allowd. Although it seems dangerous but fighters will bring there chin down and stop presenting a bad example to the public in selfdefence

14. Kicking the head of a grounded opponent.
Put in place to protect ground fighters
15. Kneeing the head of a grounded opponent.
Put in place to protect ground fighters
16. Stomping a grounded opponent.
Put in place to protect ground fighters
17. Kicking to the kidney with the heel.
Put in place to protect ground fighters
18. Spiking an opponent to the canvas on his head or neck. (see piledriver)

Every striker and grappler should know that it favours a BJJ stylest. Geez there fighting on matts for god sake.

It just funny that even rigging the rules they still getting owned by other styles of grappling

BTW I am not against BJJ. I'm trained in both grappling and striking arts but the competition which is the UFC is far from being fair they just don't want to see there art literally get stomped off the mat

 

[Ironslave]

Oh for fuck sakes.

Allowing throat strikes to "present a good example to the public on self defense?" Give me a break, why don't they put beer bottles and sticks and shit around the sides of the cage? I mean, if you're attacked (like the first clip you posted) you would surely want to do anything to defend yourself.

Why are you bitching about no punches to the back of the head, kidneys, or stomping an opponents head on the ground?? These rules were put in place for safety because they don't want to see someone get killed, or seriously injured. Boxing has similar rules on rabbit/kidney punches also.


There's no way you're trained in striking or grappling, I call bullshit. I know this is the internet, where anybody can be whatever they want to be, bit there's no way that someone who actually is trained in striking and grappling could have such a shitty outlook on the sport.

 

[Skeptic]

There are several ranges of combat its just the UFC can only demonstrate two of them. Because the other is banned

Of course its rigged for BJJ its designed and promoted by them

You are not allowed to
11. Striking to the spine or the back of the head. (see Rabbit punch)
Put in place to disadvantage strikes from taking advantage of a miss timed take down or clinch.
10. Striking downward using the point of the elbow. (see Elbow (strike))
Once again put in place to disadvantage a striker from beating his opponemt to the floor
11. Throat strikes of any kind, including, without limitation, grabbing the trachea.
Again should be allowd. Although it seems dangerous but fighters will bring there chin down and stop presenting a bad example to the public in selfdefence

14. Kicking the head of a grounded opponent.
Put in place to protect ground fighters
15. Kneeing the head of a grounded opponent.
Put in place to protect ground fighters
16. Stomping a grounded opponent.
Put in place to protect ground fighters
17. Kicking to the kidney with the heel.
Put in place to protect ground fighters
18. Spiking an opponent to the canvas on his head or neck. (see piledriver)

Every striker and grappler should know that it favours a BJJ stylest. Geez there fighting on matts for god sake.

It just funny that even rigging the rules they still getting owned by other styles of grappling

BTW I am not against BJJ. I'm trained in both grappling and striking arts but the competition which is the UFC is far from being fair they just don't want to see there art literally get stomped off the mat

Only pussies stomp someone when they are on the ground. Only pussies hit someone in the back of the head.

does this make you a pussy? i think it does

BTW Pwned by Analslave

 

[JS316]

There are several ranges of combat its just the UFC can only demonstrate two of them. Because the other is banned

Of course its rigged for BJJ its designed and promoted by them
Only the 1st UFC's were designed by the Gracies. Not now. They've even made wearing a Gi ilegal which takes away alot of chokes,throws and friction that helped Bjj and Judo.

You are not allowed to
11. Striking to the spine or the back of the head. (see Rabbit punch)
Put in place to disadvantage strikes from taking advantage of a miss timed take down or clinch.
How does that disadvantage Bjj?
10. Striking downward using the point of the elbow. (see Elbow (strike))
Once again put in place to disadvantage a striker from beating his opponemt to the floor
Why would a striker want to go to the floor? Isn't that where the Bjj guys want it?So really you mean to stop the fight from going to the floor.
11. Throat strikes of any kind, including, without limitation, grabbing the trachea.
Again should be allowd. Although it seems dangerous but fighters will bring there chin down and stop presenting a bad example to the public in selfdefence
Do you think if this rule was allowed, fighters would start aiming their punches at the throat?I actually thought choking with one hand was legal.

14. Kicking the head of a grounded opponent.
Put in place to protect ground fighters
15. Kneeing the head of a grounded opponent.
Put in place to protect ground fighters
16. Stomping a grounded opponent.
Put in place to protect ground fighters
17. Kicking to the kidney with the heel.
Put in place to protect ground fighters
18. Spiking an opponent to the canvas on his head or neck. (see piledriver)All of these are legal in some MMA orgs.(Except you are allowed to drop people on their heads in the UFC) I suppose we'll never know who's right. You think it's to protect Bjj, I think it's to get sanctioned by the athletic commissions as moves like these are seen as too brutal for TV audiences.

Every striker and grappler should know that it favours a BJJ stylest. Geez there fighting on matts for god sake.Don't they use mats in Judo,Sambo and wrestling?

It just funny that even rigging the rules they still getting owned by other styles of grapplingBro, it hasn't been style vs style since the very early UFC's. Who do you mean by "they"

BTW I am not against BJJ. I'm trained in both grappling and striking arts but the competition which is the UFC is far from being fair they just don't want to see there art literally get stomped off the mat

By the way,I'm enjoying the debate

 

[Skeptic]

harsh man i may never recover