9/11 Debunked

[Flex]

Now, let's look at some other suspicious events.

I knew it was just a matter of time before you changed the subject. Just continue to ignore all the previous facts in my last post proving Flight 77 hit the pentagon.

As usual, once one theory gets destroyed, you run on to the next and hope it can't be proven wrong as well.

If they had nothing to hide, why would Bush/Cheney only meet together behind closed doors? This response is VERY suspicious.

Even though I agree they should be interviewed separately, this was an interview by NIST for the 9/11 commission report. The questions mainly delt with our foreign policy in the middle east since the 1980's. There were no questions such as "why did WTC7 collapse?"

This really proves nothing more than W. should not be president until he can handle tough questions himself.

Why did Donald Rumsfeld say Flight 93 was shot down?

This is far from the slightest bit of evidence and you know it.

-If Flight 93 was shot down, why would the government would keep that information from us?
-Why didn't one passenger tell their friends and family members they were being shot down as they spoke on the airphones?
-Several passengers told their family members they were planning on rushing the cockpit, so give me one reason to believe that's not what happend.
-Why didn't one of the countless amount of witnesses watching the plane crash say it was shot down?
-Why is the cockpit voice recorder and flight data recorder recovered at the crash site consistent with the official story according to family members that heard it?
-The last words Tom Burnett told his wife "we have to do something!" Yet, you say they were shot down?
-Why was there no evidence found at the crash site such as missile remains?
-Flight 93 was in the air for roughly an hour after two jets flew into the World Trade Centers and one flew into the Pentagon. Every single passenger knew what the hijackers were planning, so why is it so hard to believe they fought back for control of the plane?
-In the cockpit recording transcript shortly before Flight 93 crashed, the hijacker piloting (Ziad Jarrah) tells another hijacker to stand outside the cockpit and "fight them off" referring to passengers rushing the cockpit. Explain this?


NO EVIDENCE supports that Flight 93 was shot down. Thus, there is little reason to question whether that happend James.



Ironslave, you have officially been pwned. Take your conspiracy theories and shove em up your ass.

 

[Ironslave]

Cut the bullshit James.

I've never once said I fully believe the official story. Rather, I have slapped down every single conspiracy theory you've brought up on the forum. Because I've done this, you're trying to portray me as a sheep that eats up everything the government feeds me, while portraying yourself as some sort of "patriot" that questions the government. This is a common practice done by conspiracy theorists.

That wasn't meant to be an insult, or portray anything. You either believe the "Official" story, or you don't, plain and simple. If you don't fully believe the official story, then there is something wrong with the investigation.

You continue to deny nearly EVERYTHING in the official story, despite all the evidence that proves the contrary. At the same time you tell everyone "9/11 was an inside job," even though you provide NO EVIDENCE.

No I don't, read what I've said in this thread. "I think something went on that we don't know about". Sure, some initial questions I asked may have been given an explanation, that is what learning is. Asking questions, and looking at evidence to get answers.

Let's take a look at some of the questions you asked me in the last September 11th thread, shall we?

In fact, I don't think you even know. You're like a lost toddler in the woods with a broken compass. So you tell me James, where are you getting your false information from these days?

LOL. Oh really? Give me a break, you take 5 days away from the forum just for the soul purpose of coming back with guns blazing on this thread, including posts I made over 2 years ago, and throwing insults at me, that's absolutely pathetic. You make it seem like my world will be shattered if I don't think the American Government planned and executed the worst attack on it's soil ever. Hardly... again, some event's don't add up. If there is even a few things that don't, and the government fails to address them, then that raises suspicion.

There's a reason why you've never said a missile hit the pentagon, because you never GIVE YOUR TAKE! You just ask question after question, toppled with more questions that I go in-depth into answering. Problem is, If there's one question that is tough to answer you point your finger and say "HAHA, proof that it's an inside job!!!11." Nevermind the fact the conspiracies contradict each other.

Exactly... I don't give my take because I don't know the answers. I'm not a physicist, chemist, engineer, so unlike you, I have skepticism because I don't know enough to verify. You act like you know and understand every source of info you post, when you're just being a copy and paste wizard.

First, you're claiming somebody said Flight 77 vaporized (nobody said that except Loose Change). Then, you say DNA would be impossible to retreive since the plane "vaporized" (again, check your facts).

People have said that flight 77, 93 and the WTC steel has vaporized.

Searchers recovered only about 8 percent of the potential human remains but were able to identify everyone from the fragments they did find, said Somerset County Coroner Wallace Miller.

"Most of the material was vaporized," he says.

and, from the Government Organization creating the memorial for Flight 93

http://home.nps.gov/flni/parkmgmt/upload/Centennial-Strategy.pdf


"The impact site of Flight 93 remains a cemetary; 94% of
the human remains were vaporized on site. A total of 1300 acres will be
acquired to protect the area and construct the memorial and associated
facilities as follows:"

This says the steel in NYC was vaporized.

Do you really believe it's that easy to turn bone into ASH?

No, my argument is that most of the plane was pulverized into pretty much dust, yet DNA samples inside were able to be found. Here's a quote from popular mechanics about the pentagon.

“the exterior of the plane [became] ’like a sausage skin’ that crumbled upon impact,” after which “[w]hat was left of the plane flowed into the structure in a state closer to a liquid than a solid mass.”

What you fail to realize is how much evidence survived the crash. Army Staff Sgt. Mark Williams and others have reported seeing dead bodies still strapped to their seats.

I mentioned we could go back and forth with eye witness accounts and what not, so I guess we will.


F-16 pilot Dean Eckmann, who was asked to fly over the Pentagon and report on the extent of the damage, said that he suspected that the damage had been caused by “a big fuel tanker truck because of the amount of smoke and flames coming up and ... there was no airplane wreckage off to the side.” [1]

Registered nurse Eileen Murphy, observing the site from the ground, said:


I knew it was a crash site before we got there, and I didn’t know what it was going to look like. I couldn’t imagine because the building is like rock solid. I expected to see the airplane, so I guess my initial impression was, “Where’s the plane? How come there’s not a plane?” I would have thought the building would have stopped it and somehow we would have seen something like part of, or half of the plane, or the lower part, or the back of the plane. So it was just a real surprise that the plane wasn’t there. [2]

Having run to the crash site right after the strike, Engineer Steve DeChiaro, the president of a technology firm, said: "[W]hen I looked at the site, my brain could not resolve the fact that it was a plane because it only seemed like a small hole in the building. No tail. No wings. No nothing.” [3]

Similar testimony was given by firefighters. Although Brian Ladd, a firefighter from Fort Myer, had expected to see pieces of the airplane’s wings or fuselage, he instead saw “millions of tiny pieces [of debris spread] everywhere.” This statement was quoted in Pentagon 9/11, an official account written by the Pentagon’s own historians. This book also says that when Captain Dennis Gilroy---the acting commander of the Fort Myer fire department---arrived, “he wondered why he saw no aircraft parts.” It also reports that another firefighter, Captain John Durrer, “had expected to see large parts of the plane and thought, ‘Well where's the airplane, you know, where's the parts to it?" You would think there'd be something.’” [4]

Military officers gave corroborating testimony. Karen Kwiatkowski, who was then an Air Force Lieutenant Colonel employed at the Pentagon, wrote of “a dearth of visible debris on the relatively unmarked lawn, where I stood only minutes after the impact. . . . I saw . . . no airplane metal or cargo debris.”5 Army officer April Gallop, who was seriously injured in the attack along with her two-month-old son, said:


I was located at the E ring. . . . And we had to escape the building before the floors, debris etcetera collapsed on us. And I don't recall at any time seeing any plane debris... I walked through that place to try to get out before everything collapsed on us... urely we should have seen something.6

Sgt. Reginald Powell said:


I was... impressed... with how the building stood up, after they told me the size of the plane. And then I was in awe that I saw no plane, nothing left from the plane. It was like it disintegrated as it went into the building. [7]

Similar reports were given by journalists. CNN’s Jamie McIntyre, inspecting the area outside Wedge 1 shortly after the attack, said that he was seeing only “very small pieces of the plane..., small enough that you can pick up in your hand. There are no large tail sections, wing sections, fuselage, nothing like that anywhere around.” [8] Two journalists who managed to get inside also reported an absence of the expected debris. Judy Rothschadl, a documentary producer, said: "There weren't seats or luggage or things you find in a plane.” [9] ABC’s John McWethy reported: “I got in very close, got a look early on at the bad stuff. I could not, however, see any plane wreckage.” McWethy added that the plane “had been, basically, vaporized.” [10] In offering this explanation, McWethy was evidently repeating what he had been told by Pentagon officials.

I'm sorry? I didn't realize I have to spoonfeed you every shred of evidence. You act as if we should see a picture of a large undamaged engine sitting somewhere on the grass. Dream on James, it's not that easy.

Why isn't it?? Where did it go? Show me something this size please, we are talking about a 757 jumbo jet.

Don't hold your breath for another videotape to be released which shows Flight 77's impact, because you just posted the only video that does.

Why did they only release some frames? Why not release the whole thing and put an end to it?

There's a widespread rumor that 85 tapes show Flight 77 hit the Pentagon. That rumor started from FBI Special Agent Jacqueline Maguire.

I didn't claim this.

Letter C fuselage.

That looks awful small to be a letter C on a jumbo 757 Jet.

 

[Ironslave]

Ironslave, you have officially been pwned. Take your conspiracy theories and shove em up your ass.

Fuck off. It's far from that and you know it. Again, you've taken 5 days away from Mecca to come back and post all this with insults blazing, that is pathetic, I responded to this in less than an hour. Posting these things are cool, I'll look into all of it, but don't come back with the attitude like you know everything that happened and answered it all in detail.

You still haven't addressed why Osama died his beard? Look at the photos again, do you still believe they are the same person?

All I need to do is raise questions that don't make any sense. Yet the government doesn't care, it doesn't respond to these, Bush/Rumsfeld/Cheney won't allow themselves to testify in front of people as to their thoughts on the day's event.

 

[Flex]

You act like you know and understand every source of info you post, when you're just being a copy and paste wizard.

It's called research chief, then posting the evidence and statements from professionals (not posting statements from confused reporters 1,000 feet from the scene). I guess that makes you a copy and paste wizard in the training section? I've researched over fifteen sites thoroughly so you can fuck off. You're just angry someone is proving you wrong, happens every time I shut down conspiracy theorists.

By the way, nothing in your last post is even worth responding to.

 

[Braaq]

Flex, I agree with your side.. but remember: ELE, now group hug :cardulikesmen:

 

[Flex]

Flex, I agree with your side.. but remember: ELE, now group hug :cardulikesmen:

Obviously we both strongly disagree with each other on this topic, but I don't want this thread to put anything between us.

I'm only being more aggressive in this thread, as last thread he was the aggressor. But it makes no sense for me to answer his questions throughout an entire debate, because he is the minority. Very few people believe it was an inside job, so he should be answering my questions. (not the other way around)

 

[Ironslave]

It's called research chief, then posting the evidence and statements from professionals (not posting statements from confused reporters 1,000 feet from the scene). I guess that makes you a copy and paste wizard in the training section? I've researched over fifteen sites thoroughly so you can fuck off. You're just angry someone is proving you wrong, happens every time I shut down conspiracy theorists.

Calling me a copy and paste wizard in the training section is just absurd and you know it. The difference is that I understand everything there that I post, and if someone ever asks, I tone it down in layman's terms. But the part that bothers me is when you act like you understand the process of nuclear DNA testing, advanced physics, chemistry, and so on. I don't, and I've never said I do, which is why I've refrained from commenting in depth on the issues, because I'm not an expert, I can't critique their methods, finding, and so on. I'm not "angry" about anything expect your personal remarks against me, I don't want to believe that the government was involved in the worse event in American history, and all the subsequent damage it caused, so I'll concede that you have posted convincing evidence that it was flight 77 that hit the pentagon, but the official story still doesn't come close to adding up. I don't give a shit about being "right", since I'm just asking questions that at first glance don't make any sense. If it was flight 77, why don't they release the entire video, instead of 5 frames?

Maybe it was flight 77, but if there was no involvement, how could it hit the most secure building in the world roughly an hour after it was hijacked? Norm Mineta, Secretary of Transportation (who issued grounding of flights on the day), who was in the bunker with Cheney on the day.

Why was his testimony left out of the Official Report??

here is a video of him being asked about his testimony being omitted from the "official report", and how the report claims that Cheney arrived there over 20 minutes later than Minetta did when he was there. (skip ahead around 40 seconds in, the beginning crap is annoying).

But it makes no sense for me to answer his questions throughout an entire debate, because he is the minority. Very few people believe it was an inside job, so he should be answering my questions. (not the other way around)

You are right, it makes no sense for you to be answering these questions, it makes sense for the government to answer them! Yet, Bush and Cheney would only agree to a closed door testimony together with no video or note taking allowed. Why wasn't Rumsfeld questioned on his so called "Freudian slip"? There have been other strange reactions from Bush on where he was, and what he knew that day.

Here's him acting very strange when he was asked if he had advanced knowledge on 9/11.

Or this, where Bush claims he saw the first plane hit the first tower on a TV while waiting outside a classroom.

With all these strange reactions, it's pretty easy to look into things at first glance and ask questions. I'm not the one who should be answering questions, as I'm not the one in charge of running America, directing the investigation of the day, or starting the wars since the day's event. All of these events together paint a pretty strange picture, yet the government doesn't answer them, why? It's like the Warren Commission coming out with everything they did in their report, and omiting the basic Newton's laws.

Obviously we both strongly disagree with each other on this topic, but I don't want this thread to put anything between us.

I'm only being more aggressive in this thread, as last thread he was the aggressor.

Ha, as I mentioned in a PM, debating is fine, but your belittling personal attacks were completely out of line. The other thread was over two years ago. The fact that much of a loser that you decide to take 5 days away from mecca, dig up posts from 2 years ago and bring them up again is pathetic. Here, want me to throw quotes in your face from two years ago? (Don't edit my post and delete these, like you did once before).

The government is hiding too much information to even consider the United States government had nothing to do with 911.

I'm on Ironslave, Anthony, and Banshee's side. The government was behind 9/11, no doubt. There's too much proof to list here.

I love how they claimed building 7 collapsed from a couple of small fires on a few floors. That's just laughable.

Did you notice how James Meigs (Popular Mechanics) completely changed the subject in the debate on Building 7? These guys are only out to make money off their book in my opinion.

From this point on, I won't be acknowledging anything towards you on here.

 

[Flex]

Calling me a copy and paste wizard in the training section is just absurd and you know it.

You referring to me as a "copy and paste wizard" on this topic is BY FAR one of the most foolish posts you've ever had on this site. I completely destroy you in intelligence on this subject.

But the part that bothers me is when you act like you understand the process of nuclear DNA testing, advanced physics, chemistry, and so on.

Oh absolutely. Since I said in every one my posts that i'm the fucking DNA king.

I never claimed shit. I read from the experts, look at all the evidence, then I POST IT ON HERE. It's as simple as that, you should try that rather than feeding me hundreds of questions that "don't add up" as proof 9/11 was an inside job.

I never knew you were this ignorant.

so I'll concede that you have posted convincing evidence that it was flight 77 that hit the pentagon

win.

I don't give a shit about being "right", since I'm just asking questions that at first glance don't make any sense.

Thanks for admitting your ignorance on this subject.

May I remind you that you've probably told hundreds (possibly thousands?) of people that "9/11 was an inside job!!!"

If it was flight 77, why don't they release the entire video, instead of 5 frames?

That's the whole video chief, there would be no reason to take out a few small frames. Quit acting like they did.

Maybe it was flight 77, but if there was no involvement, how could it hit the most secure building in the world roughly an hour after it was hijacked? Norm Mineta, Secretary of Transportation (who issued grounding of flights on the day), who was in the bunker with Cheney on the day.

Why was his testimony left out of the Official Report??

here is a video of him being asked about his testimony being omitted from the "official report", and how the report claims that Cheney arrived there over 20 minutes later than Minetta did when he was there. (skip ahead around 40 seconds in, the beginning crap is annoying).

You are right, it makes no sense for you to be answering these questions, it makes sense for the government to answer them! Yet, Bush and Cheney would only agree to a closed door testimony together with no video or note taking allowed. Why wasn't Rumsfeld questioned on his so called "Freudian slip"? There have been other strange reactions from Bush on where he was, and what he knew that day.

Here's him acting very strange when he was asked if he had advanced knowledge on 9/11.

Or this, where Bush claims he saw the first plane hit the first tower on a TV while waiting outside a classroom.


With all these strange reactions, it's pretty easy to look into things at first glance and ask questions. I'm not the one who should be answering questions, as I'm not the one in charge of running America, directing the investigation of the day, or starting the wars since the day's event. All of these events together paint a pretty strange picture, yet the government doesn't answer them, why? It's like the Warren Commission coming out with everything they did in their report, and omiting the basic Newton's laws.

This entire post is pathetic man.

You're resulting to facial reactions to whether or not they were behind the attacks of 9/11. Flight 77 crashing into the Pentagon was your greatest evidence that 9/11 was an inside job, and I proved you wrong. So now, you're bringing up garbage not worth debating. (as I expected)

Do I really have to respond to "dang, if you like look at his face, his face is all weird...so do you think it was an inside job because of that???"

Also, I have OVERWHELMING evidence that every one of those pictures from the first post are Osama Bin Laden and that he was behind the 9/11 attacks. The reason why I havn't posted them up on this site yet is because of how useless you responded to my previous posts. Posting it just feels like a waste of time now. I may decide to post it up if I feel like it, but I probably won't. I'll tell you this much, OBL has been attacking our countrymen since 1992 and signed fatwa's declaring he'd kill Americans in cold blood twice in the 90's, there's isn't one reason to question whether OBL carried out these attacks (with the exception of a couple low quality, poorly lighted video stills...or shall I call it...your "evidence" )

Ha, as I mentioned in a PM, debating is fine, but your belittling personal attacks were completely out of line. The other thread was over two years ago. The fact that much of a loser that you decide to take 5 days away from mecca, dig up posts from 2 years ago and bring them up again is pathetic.

You've said "like omg you took 5 days away then came back and pwned me" ten times already, put a sock in your mouth. I'm only on the internet once every several days right now when I visit my mothers.

From this point on, I won't be acknowledging anything towards you on here.
Here, want me to throw quotes in your face from two years ago? (Don't edit my post and delete these, like you did once before).

I already admitted my ignorance from two years ago, you havn't.

You're being a fool James. The 9/11 truth movement died last year yet you still believe these retarded conspiracy theories made up by educationless morons.

It's time for you to admit to everyone here that you have been very ignorant on this topic too. I did my research, it's time for you to do your own, rather than me SPOONFEEDING YOU! You're far too intelligent to buy into these weak-minded conspiracies.


CHALLENGES FOR IRONSLAVE:

CHALLENGE #1 - Give me your take on 9/11. Tell us what happend to Flight 11, Flight 175, Flight 77, and Flight 93. What happend to the passengers on the plane? Were there hijackers on the aircrafts? Answer this question if you're so sure that 9/11 is an inside job. Guaren-fuckin-tee everyone on this site you will not answer this question, because you're being ignorant. You think you can declare 9/11 an inside job with only the few questions that "don't add up" to you.

CHALLENGE #2 - If the government is "so almighty powerful" that it can stage the biggest cover-up in the history of the world (speaking of 9/11), why wouldn't they just cover up nukes being in Iraq while they are at it? That would be incredibly simple in comparison to staging September 11th.

CHALLENGE #3 - Show me the structural engineers and the demolition experts that believe the towers came down with explosives. NONE agree with your stupid theories, but ALL agree with my side. So tell me, why are all of these people in the world not coming out and declaring 9/11 was inside job? Don't feed me some bullshit like the "because they are afraid of the government." I'm talking about the whole fuckin world including Iran and China. They don't agree with you because it's 100% wrong.

CHALLENGE #4 - One thing you fail to realize is how many people would have to be behind the conspiracy if 9/11 was an inside job. I found a list of organizations first on the scene of the Pentagon crash site.

Alexandria VA Fire & Rescue, American Airlines, American Red Cross, Arlington County Emergency Medical Services, Arlington County Fire Department, Arlington County Sheriff's Department, Arlington VA Police Department, Armed Forces Institute of Pathology, Bureau of Alcohol Tobacco and Firearms, DiLorenzo TRICARE Health Clinic staff, DeWitt Army Community Hospital staff, District of Columbia Fire & Rescue, DOD Honor Guard, Environmental Protection Agency Hazmat Teams, Fairfax County Fire & Rescue, FBI Evidence Recovery Teams, FBI Hazmat Teams, Federal Aviation Administration, Federal Disaster Medical Assistance Teams, FEMA 68-Person Urban Search and Rescue Teams Maryland Task Force 1, New Mexico Task Force 1, Tennessee Task Force 1, Virginia Task Force 1, Virginia Task Force 2, FEMA Emergency Response Team, Fort Myer Fire Department, Four U.S. Army Chaplains, Metropolitan Airport Authority Fire Unit, Military District of Washington Engineers Search & Rescue Team, Montgomery County Fire & Rescue, U.S. National Guard units, National Naval Medical Center CCRF, National Transportation Safety Board, Pentagon Defense Protective Service, Pentagon Helicopter Crash Response Team, Pentagon Medical Staff, Rader Army Health Clinic Staff, SACE Structural Safety Engineers and Debris Planning and Response Teams, Salvation Army Disaster Services, U.S. Army Corps of Engineers, US Army Reserves of Virginia Beach Fairfax County and Montgomery County, Virginia Beach Fire Department, Virginia Department of Emergency Management, Virginia State Police

And that's just at the Pentagon! If you're so sure 9/11 was an inside job, why are you not contacting these people? Why are you avoiding the fact that they declare all conspiracy theorists full of shit? Are they all behind the government conspiracy? If you believe that, you've officially lost your mind James.

I challenge you to contact some of these people to ask questions about 9/11. Hopefully you don't feel too much like a loser when they laugh in your face.

 

[Zigurd]

Calm the fuck down mods. Yeah I went there.

You are supposed to be role models for users in this site, so stop fighting and insulting eachother like prepubescent schoolgirls.

K ? And don't ban me please.

 

[Tonyk212000]

Calm the fuck down mods. Yeah I went there.

You are supposed to be role models for users in this site, so stop fighting and insulting eachother like prepubescent schoolgirls.

K ? And don't ban me please.

Was gonna say the same thing but was afraid they would ban me lol or do something because were not allowed to yell at mods

 

[Flex]

Was gonna say the same thing but was afraid they would ban me lol or do something because were not allowed to yell at mods

Nobody is getting banned, feel free to say whatever you want.

This is between me and Ironslave.

 

[Braaq]

Wow this is being taken a bit too far, lets talk about Ron Paul so we can all love each other again :wutyousay:

 

[Ironslave]

You referring to me as a "copy and paste wizard" on this topic is BY FAR one of the most foolish posts you've ever had on this site. I completely destroy you in intelligence on this subject.

I never claimed shit. I read from the experts, look at all the evidence, then I POST IT ON HERE. It's as simple as that, you should try that rather than feeding me hundreds of questions that "don't add up" as proof 9/11 was an inside job.

You don't destroy me on anything. You're not an engineer, physicist, chemist, the difference is that I realize that these are out of my areas, and I'm in no position to look at the findings, and critique their methods, data analysis, results, and such. To illustrate my point, look at this.


http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entrez?db=pubmed&cmd=search&term=point+counterpoint+lactate+altitude&log$=activity

Here we have 8 different groups of researchers, all of them PhD's, all of them "experts" many of them some of the absolute best in that particular area, and yet 8 they can't come to a consensus. Posting the opinions of just one of them in this case is far from enough to be convincing. The difference is, you buy it hook, line, and sinker. I have questions, and view things with uncertainty.

Thanks for admitting your ignorance on this subject.

May I remind you that you've probably told hundreds (possibly thousands?) of people that "9/11 was an inside job!!!"

I've admitted that I don't know enough to analyze the evidence, and I've asked questions. The official story is a sham, yet you keep defending it. Sure, more evidence and analysis may have cleared up some things, but all of them? Not even close. Since you claim to be so knowledgable on this subject, put your money where your mouth is, and tell me why in scientific terms all of the following papers I've listed below are wrong? I can't even come close to this, and I know for a fact that you know just as little as I do.

CHALLENGE #3 - Show me the structural engineers and the demolition experts that believe the towers came down with explosives. NONE agree with your stupid theories, but ALL agree with my side. So tell me, why are all of these people in the world not coming out and declaring 9/11 was inside job? Don't feed me some bullshit like the "because they are afraid of the government." I'm talking about the whole fuckin world including Iran and China. They don't agree with you because it's 100% wrong.

Oh no? None? How about 535? You are dead wrong on this.

http://www.ae911truth.org/signpetition.php


These are the ones that should be debating, not me. Tons of them are PhD's, or have MSc's in engineering, nuclear physics, architecture, and so on. I don’t know anything about engineering, physics, or advanced level physical chemistry, they do, so I'd love to see you attempt to debate them on their level. No, better yet, I'd love to see the government, and others with similar credentials who have different views debate. These are the ones who should be debating, but they aren't. The government won't allow any more looking into this, why won't they?

Now, as far as reports, and other evidence, since you think you know so much on this topic (as opposed to me, who realizes that I know that there is certainly things they don't make sense, and can and have been debated), please go through these reports, and refute all the evidence.

16 Scientists, Scholars, Architects & Engineers respond to NIST
http://www.911blogger.com/node/17794

Tell me why the physical chemistry in this paper is wrong?
http://www.journalof911studies.com/volume/200704/JLobdillThermiteChemistryWTC

How about this, done by a PhD and refuting many of the claims of why the towers collapsed. What is wrong with this?

http://www.ae911truth.org/docs/Seffenrevpub.pdf

Or, look at seismic evidence, why is this wrong?

http://www.journalof911studies.com/volume/200609/ExplosionInTowerBeforeJetHitByFurlongAndRoss.pdf





This focuses on physical chemistry, and the possibilities to reach temperatures it did.

http://www.journalof911studies.com/articles/WTCHighTemp2.pdf



And as for the entire world, why has the Japanese Government questioned it?

That's the whole video chief, there would be no reason to take out a few small frames. Quit acting like they did.

There were 5 frames. Not one of them can you pause it and see a clear 757.

It should look like this. Why can’t we see the whole video?

This is the scale that it should look like. The pentagon was 78 feet high, a Boeing 757 is listed on Boeing's website as 155 feet in length, so it IS modeled to scale. Why weren't we able to pause it at all and see this?

This entire post is pathetic man.

You're resulting to facial reactions to whether or not they were behind the attacks of 9/11. Flight 77 crashing into the Pentagon was your greatest evidence that 9/11 was an inside job, and I proved you wrong. So now, you're bringing up garbage not worth debating. (as I expected)

Do I really have to respond to "dang, if you like look at his face, his face is all weird...so do you think it was an inside job because of that???"

Ha, I posted one video where he gave a very strange answer, ONE. How was it possible for Bush to claim he saw the plane hit on a TV while waiting outside the classroom?

I remember EXACTLY where I was on 9/11/01 the moment I found out, I remember who I was with, where we went to watch the news, I even remember some of the first conversations we had. This is what you call a "photographic event", something so significant you can almost relive it every time you think of it. According to the official story, Bush found out when Andrew Card whispered into his ear.

Again I ask you, why was Norman Mineta, the Secretary of Transportation's testimony left completely out of the 9/11 Commission report? Here was a member of the President's Cabinet stating that he saw Cheney in the bunker 20 minutes before the 9/11 commission report says he was, and that he was getting updates on the progress of the flight? How in the fuck could any credible investigation blatantly omit this??

Also, I have OVERWHELMING evidence that every one of those pictures from the first post are Osama Bin Laden and that he was behind the 9/11 attacks. The reason why I havn't posted them up on this site yet is because of how useless you responded to my previous posts. Posting it just feels like a waste of time now. I may decide to post it up if I feel like it, but I probably won't. I'll tell you this much, OBL has been attacking our countrymen since 1992 and signed fatwa's declaring he'd kill Americans in cold blood twice in the 90's, there's isn't one reason to question whether OBL carried out these attacks (with the exception of a couple low quality, poorly lighted video stills...or shall I call it...your "evidence" )

Post it, I dare you. Post the pictures, and lets compare to all the different videos, and let’s see if they all look like the same man. Did he have time to have surgery change his bone structure before he dyed his beard? You’re blind if you think this is all the same person, it’s like saying all Chinese people look the same.

Why were George Bush Sr., Frank Carlucci, and James Baker all meeting with Osama Bin Laden’s brother Shafiq on 9/11?

Why was this allowed?

"the United States grounded all aircraft on that terrible day, one exception was made: Top White House officials authorized planes to pick up 140 Saudis, including two dozen members of the bin Laden family, from ten cities and spirit them back to Saudi Arabia. Dale Watson, the former head of counterterrorism at the FBI, conceded in Vanity Fair that the departing Saudis "were not subject to serious interviews or interrogations. "
Tom Kinton, director of aviation at Boston's Logan Airport, was incredulous, according to Vanity Fair. With the airport still closed and reeling from the 9/11 attacks, Kinton received the order to allow the bin Ladens to fly. "We were in the midst of the worst terrorist act in history and here we were seeing an evacuation of the bin Ladens!" he exclaimed..."
…why?

You've said "like omg you took 5 days away then came back and pwned me" ten times already, put a sock in your mouth. I'm only on the internet once every several days right now when I visit my mothers.


I already admitted my ignorance from two years ago, you havn't.

You're being a fool James. The 9/11 truth movement died last year yet you still believe these retarded conspiracy theories made up by educationless morons.

It's time for you to admit to everyone here that you have been very ignorant on this topic too. I did my research, it's time for you to do your own, rather than me SPOONFEEDING YOU! You're far too intelligent to buy into these weak-minded conspiracies.

You haven't "pwned" me on anything, and you never will. You cannot pwn someone when they ask questions, and point out things that don't make sense. It's

As far as spoonfeeding me, that is just laughable. You took this to a personal level which it did not need to, and you claimed you wanted to be more aggressive because you wanted to "win" this. I stated that you believed the official story, which was not an attempt to sound like a "patriot" or make you a "conformist", it's just that you either believe the official story is right, or there are holes which need to be addressed, yet the government won't let this happen. For one, there is no "winning', because until you can answer all of these questions. Second, as I pointed out, there are hundreds of physicists, chemists, engineers, architects who also doubt the official story, so quit acting like you know the complexities of the story. One of us has been constantly "spoon fed" things by other for years on mecca/bbd, and it's not me.

 

[pegasus]

what an awesome thread.

IS i'm on your side buddy

 

[Braaq]

Great posts all around and both have done their hw, but I agree with Flex

 

[Ironslave]

what an awesome thread.

IS i'm on your side buddy

Not really awesome, sucks that Flex had to take things where he did, because he wanted to "win", but fair points have been made by both.

Great posts all around and both have done their hw, but I agree with Flex

Which is fine, however I'm of the opinion that until every one of these things I bring up is answered, I will remain skeptical of the day's events.

 

[Braaq]

Not really awesome, sucks that Flex had to take things where he did, because he wanted to "win", but fair points have been made by both.

Agreed, but I think both contributed but he escalated it.

Which is fine, however I'm of the opinion that until every one of these things I bring up is answered, I will remain skeptical of the day's events.

I agree that some things don't add up, but there are several things in history that we don't have all the answers. So people come up with assumptions or educated guesses.

 

[Ironslave]

I agree that some things don't add up, but there are several things in history that we don't have all the answers. So people come up with assumptions or educated guesses.

Yep, I'd agree. But the way I see it, this is pretty much just the same as when JFK was killed. Too many things don't add up to believe the "official story", and the government continues to hide things. In both cases, a lot of people benefited.

 

[Flex]

Aight, this is the first time I've been online for a week and I've had time to shake off the hatin.

I don't exactly have time to respond in this thread right now, nor do I even have time to read your post right now. I will when I get the time, but I would like to apologize for taking the thread too far. I admit I did.

I am strongly against every conspiracy theory I've heard about 9/11 (except a few small one's like Flight 93 being shot down). If this message board was strictly about conspiracy theories, IS and I would probably not get along well. However, it's not and this subject isn't worth ruining a friendship.

I've always considered James one of the most intelligent if not the most on this forum, and that will never change. I just feel on this topic he's getting his information from misleading, cherry-picking, manipulating people.

This post is in no way an admittance that I can't prove 9/11 isn't an inside job, it's just me admitting it's not worth losing a friend in James.

 

[Ironslave]

Aight, this is the first time I've been online for a week and I've had time to shake off the hatin.

I don't exactly have time to respond in this thread right now, nor do I even have time to read your post right now. I will when I get the time, but I would like to apologize for taking the thread too far. I admit I did.

I am strongly against every conspiracy theory I've heard about 9/11 (except a few small one's like Flight 93 being shot down). If this message board was strictly about conspiracy theories, IS and I would probably not get along well. However, it's not and this subject isn't worth ruining a friendship.

I've always considered James one of the most intelligent if not the most on this forum, and that will never change. I just feel on this topic he's getting his information from misleading, cherry-picking, manipulating people.

This post is in no way an admittance that I can't prove 9/11 isn't an inside job, it's just me admitting it's not worth losing a friend in James.

I'm not cherry picking or manipulating anything (especially not others). When these questions can be answered, let me know. It's fair to say that I might not be getting information from the most credible places, but I'd argue that these "debunking" have just as little credibility.

You can't prove it wasn't, I can't prove it was. Someone can ask questions, another can try and answer them, sometimes the answers don't add up. If you have a deep look into it, there are WAY too many things that don't add up. It's an impossible debate for you to "win", in general, because you can't answer the physical chemistry, physics, and most of all, the odd behavior.

If you wish to respond to the above post, I have no problem with that.