5x5 routine help

[Hypocrisy86]

Thinking about starting a 5x5 thing.
since i do have time constraints now for my new job
(messed up hours) i need a new routine thing..
5x5 seems nice.

but i don't quite now how to do this.
ive been doing instictive training as of late, going in
and doing whatever my body feels like it needs done.

3 days a week is all i can work with.

so im guessing something like..

Tuesday -
flat press (db or BB)
bb curls
bb row
Stiff leg deads

Thursday -
incline press (db or bb)
squats
seated cable row
military press (db or BB)

Saturday -
calf press
abs
tricep dips (machine or weighted)
bicep curls (db or BB)

 

[philosopher]

Imo its not the best designed protocol.

I would go for an upper/lowerbody protocol

Mon: A
Wed: B
Fri: A
Mon B
Wed A
Fri: B
etc....

Workout A could be something like
Bench press
Bent over Row
Incl or Military press
T-bar row or chin/pull up
Bicep curl
Tricep ext

Workout B could be something like
Squat or DL
RDL or GM
Leg presses or lunges or bulgarian split squats
Leg curls
Calves
Abs

 

[Hypocrisy86]

thanks for helping Philo.
i can't go to the gym more than 3 times a week though..
I need a split that can work the whole body, using 3 days split.

 

[The Creator]

^^it is only 3 times a week. MWF. Go with what he set out for you.

 

[Hypocrisy86]

Whats RDL and GM?

 

[philosopher]

Whats RDL and GM?

Romanian Deadlifts and Goodmornings

 

[lifterdead]

5x5 works great for powerlifting, if you're interested. I used this and slammed a good 25 more pounds onto my bench.


(see attachment)

 

[El Freako]

I back the 5x5 that lifterdead posted, here's the website: http://www.geocities.com/elitemadcow1/5x5_Program/Periodized_5x5.htm

You'll make great strength gains from it.

 

[Hypocrisy86]

thanks guys, i'll start this next week
right now im eating heh

 

[Unregistered]

What do you mean with '5x5 routine'?

Are you simply doing 5 sets of 5 reps on each exercise? The idea behind 5 x 5 routines, like the ones created by Rippetoe and popularized by Madcow is the progression plan behind it. Randomly doing 5 sets of 5 reps without any programming in progression will get you nowhere.

 

[Hypocrisy86]

5x5 works great for powerlifting, if you're interested. I used this and slammed a good 25 more pounds onto my bench.


(see attachment)

I will go from this, thanks Lifter.
starting next week, weeks 1-5 are gonna be a toughy.

 

[Hypocrisy86]

Okay i have the Bill starr pdf you attached Lifter
i printed it out, will start it next week since i dont have money
to buy the proper food i need ..

 

[Essensen]

A suggestion.

Tuesday

Back Squat 5 sæt x 5 reps
Bench press 5 sæt x 5 reps
Military press 5 sæt x 5 reps
Db rows 3 x 10
Barbell curls 3 x 10
Skull crushers 3 x 10
abs 3 sæt x 10 reps


Thursday

Deadlift 5 x 5 reps
Bent Over Barbell Rows (m. reverse grip) 5 x 5 reps
Reverse Grip Chin Ups 5 x 5 reps
Cg benchpress 3 x 10
Incline db curls 3 x 10
Abs with resistance 3 x 10 reps


Saturday

Front Squat 5 x 5 reps
Incline benchpress 5 x 5 reps
Seated rows: 3 x 10
Db bench press
Dips 5 sæt x 5 reps
Reverse curls:
abs with resistance 3 sæt x 10 reps

 

[Hypocrisy86]

thanks Essen, i will print that add and try it for first week

 

[The_KM]

Just some thoughts:

The ability to hit 5 reps on each set is pretty hypothetical. If it's possible you can perform 5 sets for 5 reps, then the weight you're using is too light. I'd probably switch it up occasionally to prevent any possible neural limitations you gain when maximal overload is reached.

I really feel this routine will do great for strength improvement but little for actual muscle hypertrophy. If you use a conjugated method, or switching the routine every so often, you will bring the hypertrophy aspects into play. But again, this depends on your goal and the switches made. Constant stagnating will bring ONLY neurological adaption rather than overload.

What do you mean with '5x5 routine'?

Are you simply doing 5 sets of 5 reps on each exercise? The idea behind 5 x 5 routines, like the ones created by Rippetoe and popularized by Madcow is the progression plan behind it. Randomly doing 5 sets of 5 reps without any programming in progression will get you nowhere.

Good point.

In most cases, like I said above, you won't work 5 reps every set. It most likely will look something like this:

Set 1: 5x100 lbs
Set 2: 4x100 lbs
Set 3: 3x100 lbs
Set 4: 3x100 lbs
Set 5: 2x100 lbs

When you can achieve 5 reps at every set, is when you move on. Which how progression is formed from this program. Furthermore, the fact that the 5x5 principle is only used for 1 exercise/body part, and most likely (as Essessen demonstrated) the remaining will be a higher rep range.

That said, both aspects of hypertrophy and/or strength, are recruited and built upon...disregarding the common misconception of periodization which does other wise in most cases.

Good luck with the routine hypocrisy! I'm sure you'll see some awesome results from it! Highly reputable program as well.

Cheers

 

[philosopher]

Just some thoughts:

The ability to hit 5 reps on each set is pretty hypothetical. If it's possible you can perform 5 sets for 5 reps, then the weight you're using is too light. I'd probably switch it up occasionally to prevent any possible neural limitations you gain when maximal overload is reached.

I really feel this routine will do great for strength improvement but little for actual muscle hypertrophy. If you use a conjugated method, or switching the routine every so often, you will bring the hypertrophy aspects into play. But again, this depends on your goal and the switches made. Constant stagnating will bring ONLY neurological adaption rather than overload.



Good point.

In most cases, like I said above, you won't work 5 reps every set. It most likely will look something like this:

Set 1: 5x100 lbs
Set 2: 4x100 lbs
Set 3: 3x100 lbs
Set 4: 3x100 lbs
Set 5: 2x100 lbs

When you can achieve 5 reps at every set, is when you move on. Which how progression is formed from this program. Furthermore, the fact that the 5x5 principle is only used for 1 exercise/body part, and most likely (as Essessen demonstrated) the remaining will be a higher rep range.

That said, both aspects of hypertrophy and/or strength, are recruited and built upon...disregarding the common misconception of periodization which does other wise in most cases.

Good luck with the routine hypocrisy! I'm sure you'll see some awesome results from it! Highly reputable program as well.

Cheers

I do not fully agree on this. And instead of telling why I feel that way I'm gonna post some words from Madcow because I couldnt have said it better.

Also, I keep hearing "5x5 will put muscle on you if you eat enough but it is not a hypertrophy program."

1) No program will put muscle on you if you don't eat enough, come the hell on.

2) As discussed in the Training Primer, hypertrophy is mainly centered around relatively high levels of tension (load on the bar relative to your capacity) and volume of work. 5 sets of 5 reps enable both and strike a good balance (not golden, not directly from God, not the only rep and volume range you'll ever need, not magic - just a good general balance for highly productive core lifts).

3) Load progression (through adding absolute weight/tension, volume/work or a combination yielding more total workload over a period) is fundamental to hypertrophy. One of the things that enables this progression and subsequent hypertrophy is neural adaptation - rapid neural adaptation facilitating progressive loading is what is behind the newbie gains that everyone enjoys early in their training career (so yes, it matters). Sets of 5 are very good at driving the neural adaptation and far better than higher rep ranges (and so is higher frequency which is why you see 2-3x weekly sessions on the same lifts). Combine that with levels of tension and enough workload and you get a very balanced program. Keep in mind, this isn't about maximizing hypertrophy for a single workout. This is about maximizing hypertrophy over a period of time, and the continued neural adaptation allows for more load on the bar and total workload - hence hypertrophy providing your diet is geared to that goal.

4) That doesn't mean that sets of 5 are the end all be all of programming. All that means is that it's a decent foundation, it works well, there are very good reasons why it works, and I'd venture for most people, no matter how advanced or for most specialized purposes, it would be useful for at least part of the year.

5) And just for the record, a complete hypertrophy plan is likely going to require multiple phases to bring one's physique to the pinnacle of achievement - if that is the goal and someone is narrow-minded enough to believe that I'm actually talking about a career or even a yearly plan. Just to be clear - this is the type of work that gets the novice started or helps someone pile on the foundation muscle to move up a weightclass. Please read the Training Primer where I address some of this more completely.

 

[The_KM]

Numbers 4 and 5 I stated in my post.
Number 1 is obvious.

Number 3, I agree with the 2nd half of the paragraph. Newbie gains, yes, are due to neurological adaptions but not simply because of the facilitation of progressive overload. As a beginner trainee, glycogen uptake/synthesis is relatively higher and blood circulation is increased. A constant fluctuation of routine (every week, for example) would also provides gains of neural adaption.

Like the program, you stick with it a while. As stated in point 5, a hypertrophy plans require multiple phases, allowing time for a progressive workload through each phase. So, for example: someone would go from cycles of HST, 5x5 Routine, DC, undulation rep ranges, 3x10, etc. Reasoning for this being important as it will not allow other forms of hypertrophy to atrophy while in disuse (in this case, sacroplasmic).

Also, just like stated in point 1, everything works. But everything doesn't work forever. Which is my we conjugate which is what he explains. He also states in that excerpt that the 5 reps are a goal, almost identical to what I said.

However,

I assume you disagree with how I stated "I really feel this routine will do great for strength improvement but little for actual muscle hypertrophy"....I'm wrong, straight up. It seems it is a common misconception through others. Most feel reps from 2-4 will do very little for hypertrophy and would be the bearings powerlifters train upon (strength).

Lastly as a side note, I think going to failure that frequently will result in a CNS drain and eventually adrenal fatigue much faster.

 

[philosopher]

However,

I assume you disagree with how I stated "I really feel this routine will do great for strength improvement but little for actual muscle hypertrophy"....I'm wrong, straight up. It seems it is a common misconception through others. Most feel reps from 2-4 will do very little for hypertrophy and would be the bearings powerlifters train upon (strength).

Yep thats what I ment. Ive seen guys using the 5x5 protocol with great results both strength and hypertrophy wise.

Lastly as a side note, I think going to failure that frequently will result in a CNS drain and eventually adrenal fatigue much faster.

Failure in the 5x5 protocol? Eventually you will hit failure but that should not happen anywere near 7-9 weeks when using the intermediate program. If you stall (hit failure) to frequent you should restart the cycle or exercise because its build around the overload principle. If this isnt applied anymore than the effectiveness of the program is decreased.

Btw great post m8

 

[curtisymoo]

as for your 3 day a week

why not this

A: chest bis tris abs
B: legs + calves
C: back shoulders

im hoping your b and c day are at least a good day apart. lower back lower back gotta watch that

 

[Hypocrisy86]

I get tuesdays and wednesdays off.
hmm..

is there a way to do this in a 2-day split